Judges: No facts to support Zuma's appeal

Bloemfontein - The Supreme Court of Appeal has no facts before it to decide whether the so-called spy tapes are part of a confidential representation by President Jacob Zuma to the NPA, SCA judges said on Friday.

"Put something before us that is proof that the tapes would reveal the representations," SCA president Judge Lex Mpati told Zuma's counsel, Kemp J Kemp.

The court is hearing an appeal by Zuma against a North Gauteng High Court order that the National Prosecuting Authority hand over a copy of the so-called spy tapes to the Democratic Alliance.

The tapes, transcripts, and other documents relate to a decision the NPA took in 2009 to drop corruption charges against Zuma.

On Friday, Judge Fritz Brand asked Kemp: "If the reader of the tapes does not know your representations, if he reads the transcript, would he know what your representations would be?"

Tapes existed before Zuma made representations

Kemp replied it would be difficult as the independent source, the tapes, could be a poison tree or fruit.

"I do not know where the tree is or the fruit," replied Brand.

The judges bombarded Kemp with questions challenging him to show, with facts, that the tapes were part of the confidential representations.

They argued the tapes were already in existence before Zuma made his representations.

Kemp kept returning to his argument that, if any document formed part of the representations, that document then formed part of the confidential representations.

Later, replying to a question, Kemp agreed he had to be able to make an argument based on facts.

He eventually conceded that his argument, that the tapes as a whole possibly formed part of the confidential representations, was not based on fact.

This was after the judges indicated that nobody, not the NPA, the DA, or Zuma, had supplied any evidence that the tapes could be part of the confidential representations.


Sean Rosenberg, for the DA, agreed there was no substantial argument in Zuma's appeal.

The parties agreed in principle to a proposal formulated by the court in an effort to resolve the matter.

The lawyers agreed in principle to a third party, a senior legal mind, to be asked to judge what notes and documents, memorandums and transcripts formed part of the confidential representations.

Those would then be left out in the bundle of documents to be handed to the DA, as the SCA had decided earlier.

The parties have until 16:00 Friday next week, 22 August, to deliver an agreement to the SCA to be made a court order.

Rosenberg said they would agree in principle to such an agreement. If the parties could not come to an agreement the high court's decision on appeal would stand.

"If we cannot come to an agreement the original order stands," Kemp also submitted in reply.

Judgement was reserved.

Mally Gee 2014-08-15 07:16:10 PM
How much longer are we going to listen to these stalling tactics?
Enig Ma 2014-08-15 07:16:24 PM
You are clearly out of your depth Kemp. This is no criminal court case where you can very far being devious. This is a game of chess, and unfortunately for you one has to be really clever for this game. Brand will burn you big time.
Made-In SA 2014-08-15 07:38:37 PM
In a recent edition of the investigating newspaper on Fridays,i read an interesting article of exactly what the spytapes were. They were the result of a full blown SAPS Crime Intelligence operation,dating back to 2003,called Operation Destroy Lucifer,targeting around 45 people in the NPA and Scorpions like Leonard McCarthy and Gerrie Nel. Another interesting fact is that a former commander of Crime Intelligence,Mulangi Mphegho,at one point in the endless prosecutoral wars stated under oath that these phone intercepts reveal that the NDPP who decided not to charge Number One,Mokotedi Mpshe, had an affair with a prosecutor in Kimberley and that he alledgedly approved fraudulent travel claims by her in order to pursue the relationship with him.Nice blackmailing material don't you think? Mpshe is still an acting judge in the Land Claims court 4 years after he left the post of NDPP and has never appeared before the Judicial Services Commission,where difficult questions can be asked. In that article it is also clearly stated that Mpegho in 2007 approved an application to conduct phone and electronic intercepts of 6 targets on the basis that they are drug suspects.One of that suspects was Leonard McCarthy. A certain Richard Mdluli also approached a certain Prince Mokotedi,head of the NPA "Integrity" Management Unit in September 2007,to ask for help in his investigation of Gerrie Nel,Mokotedi referred him to a certain Nomgcobo Jiba
Tina Schilling 2014-08-15 08:13:58 PM
Simple time-wasting on the side of Zuma....the plan...prolong everything as long as possible whilst planning other moves
Viman Singh 2014-08-15 08:25:23 PM
Instead of the president focusing on the countries issues, his mind is definitely focused on issues around his personal life. We need a president to represent the people
Robert Magaya Cele 2014-08-15 08:41:22 PM
Why South African keep on supporting that man, while he doesn't care about your life.Jail him for life.
Louis Scholtz 2014-08-15 08:46:39 PM
Man sluit die moer toe, ons belastingbetalers is gatvol om vir sy souse te sorg, kook hom en gee dit vir die honger honde!
Lums Zindela 2014-08-15 08:55:44 PM
And how the hell are we going to see the tapes that never existed? is Kemp somewhat a magician? oh, let't wait and see
Tiaan de Witt 2014-08-15 09:10:49 PM
the only fact is that jz is a lying thief! please some1 shoot the idiot
George Gibbs 2014-08-15 09:14:00 PM
Any opposition in SA would attach the ANC. If you hand nothing to hide No1 why would you go so far? If you were beyond reproach you should welcome any court action to vindicate yourself and you political party and the alliance... #courtdecide